Trusts for Dummies

The nature, history and formation of Trusts.

Re: Trusts for Dummies

Postby Highspirit » Sat Mar 20, 2010 1:00 pm

Farmerboy. good to hear you are seeing the information for what it is my friend :)

Your'e right, everyone should start reading and learning this stuff because it is without any doubt whatsoever, the answer. I am confident to say for myself that d/c has been a total blind alley scam.

Everything you see in the public is what you believe to be d/c but read all your paperwork and 'agreements' that you have and the trust terminology will leap off the page and slap ur face. Voila, they trapped you in an Implied/secret Trust, hidden behind the Mask of d/c.

Con-tracts do not exist in any way shape or form when you wake-up and see the Trust.

HS :)
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Re: Trusts for Dummies

Postby nameless » Sat Mar 20, 2010 1:46 pm

I have two more utilities to AFV and I have heard that there is a Trust based version of doing AFV, for want of a better description, but I can't for the life of me remember where I heard about this.

If there is a Trust alternative, I would rather do that and would be happy to be a guinea pig. Can anyone put me onto a link for further research on this particular topic?

Farmerboy - is it the Gilberts Trust pdf you are referring to? I have just downloaded this and will make a start on it tonight.
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Re: Trusts for Dummies

Postby BaldBeardyDude » Sat Mar 20, 2010 2:51 pm

nameless wrote:I have two more utilities to AFV and I have heard that there is a Trust based version of doing AFV, for want of a better description, but I can't for the life of me remember where I heard about this.

If there is a Trust alternative, I would rather do that and would be happy to be a guinea pig. Can anyone put me onto a link for further research on this particular topic?

Farmerboy - is it the Gilberts Trust pdf you are referring to? I have just downloaded this and will make a start on it tonight.


If you read up to page 15, you will have the remedy you seek by then. However, this is not like D/C, this requires dilligent and patient research and thought, it really is deep and hard at first, but after several 'light bulb' moments, you will begin to see these trusts everywhere. Each and every word needs to be checked for meaning, as words that sound familiar and are understood to mean one thing, often turn out to mean something way different.

As an example, I have read several dozen statutes (some hundreds of years old), endless web pages, have over 15 books yet to START, never mind the ones I have done and let's not forget the vigils until 5 or 6 in the morning listening to audio files form CW, the shows and calling in with questions and the like. It is tough, and the simple truth is this - no-one can TEACH this, it can only be learned. Unless you yourself 'see' certain points, you will not progress. Knowledge can only be gained, not given - I would love to pour it into everyones head right now, but it will not help at all - quite the opposite. We can tell you where to look and where to get stuff, but it is a real hard slog after.

We have all tried to wake others, trying to teach them what we know - how difficult is it? Why is it so? Because these people we wish to educate will ONLY learn when and if they see this FOR THEMSELVES - this is no different, merely more intense.

Question: When is a debt not a debt? Answer: When it's an asset.

Question: How do I turn a debt into an asset? That's what your remedy is in this case nameless (and it is within the first 15 pages of a single book.)

Once at this point, you will have seen enough to realise what is really going on. After that the rest is up to you, but choose wisely. :wink: :mrgreen:
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Re: Trusts for Dummies

Postby nameless » Sat Mar 20, 2010 8:23 pm

Many thanks, indeed BaldBeardyDude. I have just spent quite a few days preparing another Notice for HMRC and, after catching up with the latest Active Posts, I will read the first 15 pages of Gilberts as you have suggested.
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Re: Trusts for Dummies

Postby nameless » Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:15 pm

Are we looking at Trusts as in the mirror, like debtor/creditor, or is it what it says? I appreciate what you have said, BaldBeardyDude, but it may take me some time to comprehend, so I hope you will accept my questions for what they are within my (thus far) limited comprehension.

On page VII of Gilberts Trust, No. 145, it says:

"(1) Trust estate not liable for trustee's personal debts
The trustee's personal creditors cannot satisfy their claims from trust property."

Does, or could this mean, for example, that the mortgage company cannot foreclose as this would be the only way they could satisfy their claim from the trust property?
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Re: Trusts for Dummies

Postby BaldBeardyDude » Mon Mar 22, 2010 8:53 pm

nameless wrote:Are we looking at Trusts as in the mirror, like debtor/creditor, or is it what it says? I appreciate what you have said, BaldBeardyDude, but it may take me some time to comprehend, so I hope you will accept my questions for what they are within my (thus far) limited comprehension.

On page VII of Gilberts Trust, No. 145, it says:

"(1) Trust estate not liable for trustee's personal debts
The trustee's personal creditors cannot satisfy their claims from trust property."

Does, or could this mean, for example, that the mortgage company cannot foreclose as this would be the only way they could satisfy their claim from the trust property?


Who is the trustee in this case? and are you sure, or is it just that you BELIEVE that this party is the trustee? If the latter is the case, then it could be that this party is merely construed as the trustee (TRUSTEE - the party with the fiduciary duties)

Now ask yourself who has the BENEFIT of living in and using the house, the one who would BENEFIT from any EQUITY in the house, when sold? This party is the BENEFICIARY - this party is the one who receives the benefit of the trust property.

Mortgages are the most complex of the trust stuff you may deal with and it is worth remembering, there are probably at least three seperate trusts in most mortgages, sometimes it may be more. People are trying to unravel this, but it does take time and will be ready when it's done :mrgreen:

Creditor/Debtor has been with us in various forms for at least 20 years and even now, it seems difficult to get straight, consistent answers. Trust research is 5 months old in this particular form and is obviously in it's infancy, so will take time.

BBD
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Re: Trusts for Dummies

Postby nameless » Mon Mar 22, 2010 9:55 pm

Again, many thanks for your reply BaldBeardyDude.

Continuing on the subject of mortgages, yes, I see how we are beneficiary, but we also have obligations. How does the beneficiary have obligations? Regarding being construed as the trustee, is this from the outset of the mortgage, as I was under the impression that we are construed as trustee (in breach of trust) in court in order for the 'lender' to foreclose?
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Re: Trusts for Dummies

Postby BaldBeardyDude » Mon Mar 22, 2010 11:44 pm

nameless wrote:Again, many thanks for your reply BaldBeardyDude.

Continuing on the subject of mortgages, yes, I see how we are beneficiary, but we also have obligations. How does the beneficiary have obligations? Regarding being construed as the trustee, is this from the outset of the mortgage, as I was under the impression that we are construed as trustee (in breach of trust) in court in order for the 'lender' to foreclose?


If you are beneficiary of a single trust this cannot happen, obviously, so.....?

Being misconstrued as trustee is very common, but in this case, you really are a trustee too. I know this sounds like insanity, but if you see that the house, the 'loan' and the 'charge' are seperate trusts, can you see how you could seem to occupy two positions at once?

If you have them, truly READ your mortgage documents - ALL of them, including and especially, the mortgage offer, terms and conditions and application forms. Use a legal dicionary and literally draw what you see happening in each part and stage of the process. See how many and where trusts are formed, who actually puts the charge on the land, everything in there.

Because none of us read these instruments at the time, do it now - make damn sure you know what you signed and allowed them to do IN YOUR NAME and with your power of attourney!

If you see less than three trusts, read them again and keep hammering until it makes sense, it is the only way. There are multiple trusts as I said, we think at least three - find them.

BBD
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Re: Trusts for Dummies

Postby Farmerboy » Tue Mar 23, 2010 8:59 am

Quick comment about being a beneficiary. The sole purpose of a beneficiary is to benefit.

Trustees make decisions - that's their job - so the only obligation that you can have is to benefit. If you don't want to benefit or be involved in the trust then simply then resign - it is not a mandatory, permanent, enforceable position.

Such is my understanding.

To do this you only have to write to the trustees and tell them so. If you do that then you are released from the trust. However, if you continue to receive and enjoy the 'benefit', then by your actions, you have entered into a trust. It could be argued either way that the trust continues (it never stopped) or that you have created a new trust and appointed trustees etc.

So the question is "whats the benefit?"

As always, i'm open to correction but I think i'm right.
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Re: Trusts for Dummies

Postby Highspirit » Tue Mar 23, 2010 2:52 pm

Hi FB, you can only decline to be the Beneficiary in an Expressed Trust, or if you express the trust then you can move the titles to your own advantage. You may not want to decline to be the Beneficiary.

Remember, most of the time you are in a secret/implied trust and as such, how can you define yourself as any title atall without expression? You cannot assume a title in an implied trust and then decide what you want to do with that title as it hasn't been proven to exist.

You must claim and prove a Trust before you can assume any titles whatsoever in an implied trust as they will simply deny one exists and say you are in d/c.

You are in the main deemed to be the Trustee, not the Beneficiary and the Trustee is always guilty.

I hope that helps as it was a little unclear as to where you are coming from.

HS :)
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